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CherryBabyPosted: 2009-07-02 18:03
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I've noticed that there are some people who use BDSM as a way to work through abuse that they suffered. But what about somebody who is opposite? Somebody who is kinky, but too afraid to allow things to get too "deep" because they are afraid they will start seeing it as abuse as well? What would you say to somebody like that? And let's also say this person is in therapy.

Edited to add: I think what I'm trying to say is, this person is afraid they can't deal with the psychological ramifications of it because they were abused.

Edited by - CherryBaby on 2009-07-02 18:10:01

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_GhostPosted: 2009-07-02 18:06
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That it's consensual - the biggest difference between sadism and abuse. It only becomes abuse when a line is knowingly crossed (I say knowingly because sometimes things happen that can be laughed off). The people who use BDSM to work through abuse are extremely rare. The ones who believe it may lead to abuse are more common because of the way we are all socialized (a subject of much debate in this forum).
--

"I love this moment so much I want to have sex with it..." -Dr. Cox [scrubs]
"...by the by, this moment is so great, I'd cheat on that other moment from before, marry this one and raise a family of tiny, little moments."
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JinxaliciousPosted: 2009-07-02 18:42
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That's why I'm really careful with anything S&M related. If you knew me when I first started a profile here, you'll have seen that I listed anything involving spanking/beating/etc. as a hard limit.

I don't really want to share much of my past. So without digging up past uglies:

The best I can come up with is that I don't have problems because I don't have psychological hang-ups about my past.

Someone who is afraid of psychological ramifications of BDSM should probably consider their mental stability. If they find themselves equating their SO with someone that abused them, they clearly still have issues. Honestly, some aspects of BDSM might not be right for them at all if, instead of turning them on, it threatens their psychological well-being.

So if they're in therapy, they should talk it out and see about getting to a comfortable place with anything that might be interfering with their ability to kick back and enjoy their kinky leanings.

Hope that was helpful?
--


~Jinx
---

“If you believe in peace, act peacefully; if you believe in love, act lovingly; if you believe every which way, then act every which way…” ~ Tom Robbins
"You can kiss a fool, you can let a fool kiss you, but never let a kiss fool you" ~ Anonymous
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RiptideMonzarcPosted: 2009-07-02 21:00
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Ultimately, how one perceives the world depends almost entirely upon one's own convictions and decisions. Many people, likely a majority of people, view any form of bondage or physical exploration to be abuse. It's up to each person to decide on their own limits, what they're willing to accept and explore.

If someone begins seeing their situation as abuse, then it is abusive. Their perception becomes reality, even if their partner(s) do not see the relationship in the same light. Any sane person should be willing to accept limits, push where appropriate, and back off when necessary. Put more simply, if Person A and Person B enter into some kind of exchange and Person A decides they've gone beyond their limit, then Person A is being abused simply because they feel they are being abused. It is then Person A's responsibility to communicate this feeling to Person B; B's response would hopefully be to continue communication and assess where these feelings come from. If B continues with the behavior even after it's been addressed as abusive, then B becomes fully complicit in the abuse and should no longer be trusted.

Ultimately I would tell Person A to be forthright with any potential partners they might have. Open up lines of communication, and keep them open before, during, and after scenes (and before, during, and after major stages in the relationship). Hopefully they find someone(s) who can understand and help them in their journey to satisfaction.
--


The ruined Library of Alexandria is my Mecca; Hypatia and Giordano Bruno stand within my Martyrs’ Hall. My holy tome consists of wisdom gleaned with sweat and blood and fire; my religion grows not because of faith, but in spite of it. Reason is my hymnal, logic my prayer. My laws spring from the very fabric of being itself. My sacrament rests on the majesty of Nature, and my vows bind me to this world, rather than the broken promises of the next.
9/11 -- The Original Faith-Based Initiative
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ArabSlaveGirlPosted: 2009-07-02 23:12
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Its best to work through those issues before embarking on anything that "this person" may see as abuse.

Also I think if "this person" has a lot of trust in their partner which has been built up over time then anything that could become an issue, wont.

Ive never equated any of our S&M activities to anything that may have happened in the past..its just never been a issue for me...I have never been in therapy but thats only because im pretty good at self therapy and working through things on my own. Therapy works for some people though.

If "this person" sees anything as being abusive toward them then it is abuse...what is abuse to one person isnt abuse to the next..we all draw our own lines at the end of the day.
--


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BaronslairPosted: 2009-07-03 11:01
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CherryBaby:
I've noticed that there are some people who use BDSM as a way to work through abuse that they suffered. But what about somebody who is opposite? Somebody who is kinky, but too afraid to allow things to get too "deep" because they are afraid they will start seeing it as abuse as well? What would you say to somebody like that? And let's also say this person is in therapy.

Edited to add: I think what I'm trying to say is, this person is afraid they can't deal with the psychological ramifications of it because they were abused.

Edited by - CherryBaby on 2009-07-02 18:10:01


That person is wired too tightly for vanilla or BDSM.BDSM
isn't a good place to deal with one's vanilla past or current problems.....they will simply become more complicated.
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BabieGothikaPosted: 2009-07-03 17:48
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i think there are limits for everything even for consesual
abuse, it has a limit. I dont believe when people say than
they have not limits, like humans we have limits.There is
a moment when your brain says:" Stop".


_evil_evil_evil_tongue_tongue_tongue_tongue_tongue
--


' YO no quiero solo tu cuerpo; quiero tu alma"...

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wanderingceltPosted: 2009-07-03 19:01
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Practice stopping. Learn that when you need it to stop it will stop.

Talk. Observe whether you are heard.

Be prepared to be shaken and to perceive things going over the line. Be aware that the perception is not the same as the intent, likely. But the perception of something going wrong is enough reason to stop it, until you feel safe again.

Now, if you want the perception of things not being safe and being out-of-control, as some do, that's a different set of problems.

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Celeste43Posted: 2009-07-03 20:39
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I'd tell them to relax, nothing has to be done today. Which means if you can handle a light spanking but nothing more, then have fun with the light spankings. If you keep it light and don't push for more, in a few months you'll be able to handle a little more. And so on. And in three years you'll look back and be surprised at how far you've come.

However this is best done inside of a strong relationship. A play only partner who wants it all today is the worst person to be with.
--


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Salud y amor y tiempo para disfrutarlo
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DrInTheHousePosted: 2009-07-03 20:59
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CherryBaby:
Somebody who is kinky, but too afraid to allow things to get too "deep" because they are afraid they will start seeing it as abuse as well? What would you say to somebody like that? And let's also say this person is in therapy?

Therapy so what?

As for BDSM--do what interests you and you are comfortable with. Don't do what you don't want to do or aren't comfortable with. This isn't rocket surgery. Some folks are kinky. Abuse is non-consensual. Just stick to what is consensual, and you'll be fine.

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onesassylassyPosted: 2009-07-03 21:44
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Having been down this path myself - I'd say that (at least for me) ASG and Celeste have it spot on. Trusting the person you are with is key - but so is working through it, outside of the kink. The slow building up assists in the desensitization for some of us - YMMV.

To give you an idea of where I'm coming from, when limper and I first met in person, I couldn't handle ANYTHING too close to my face or neck - especially my throat. Now, 2 yrs and a pair of wedding rings later (though this development came before the rings), he can often BITE my throat (though he still can't make it a rapid attack), and I sometimes even crave it, when we play. Not always on either count - but even on the (now rare) occasions when I can't go there, he has learned to read me well enough to prevent it from turning to panic for me. To us, that is HUGE progress, compared to barely being able to even kiss the side of my neck, slowly and in a 'vanilla' manner.

Trust is the first key - patience is the next.

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daddyslilonePosted: 2009-07-04 04:25
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i'd suggest only doing what is fun for you and when it stops being fun, stop everything and proceed onto something else kinky and fun...

stay away from some of the deep emotional trappings that a relationship might entail.


However this is best done inside of a strong relationship. A play only partner who wants it all today is the worst person to be with.

not necessarily true; i've found through the years that it's the relationship factor that feed into our feelings of insecurities, mis-trust, being pushed beyond our comfort levels, etc. play partners, on the other hand, know up-front what is acceptable to you and have no reason to push for more or push harder because they know from the get-go that they can get things that they can't get from you, from someone else down the road.

--


within the arms of weakness is strength, eager to burst free. within the grasp of pain is pleasure, waiting just to be. and within the path of obstacles lies opportunity...(The Princess Who Believed in Fairy Tales)

Edited by - daddyslilone on 2009-07-04 05:05:32

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lally3Posted: 2009-07-04 07:20
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CherryBaby:

Edited to add: I think what I'm trying to say is, this person is afraid they can't deal with the psychological ramifications of it because they were abused.

Edited by - CherryBaby on 2009-07-02 18:10:01


its tricky.

i dont want to go into uglies either, but i was date raped once and when a D i was seeing some time past suggested raping me anyway i went into uber-freak.

im still not sure i could do that role play even now, and ive grown a great deal in the last couple of years from meeting up with some amazingly sensitive and understanding D's. some areas are no-go absolutely and you need to respect them.

other areas can be approached carefully and sensitively, its all about knowing and understanding youre partner and building up their confidence slowly.

remember that a little can go a long way, so keep it fun and funky and mixed in with some loving and cuddling and lots of reassurance.

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GryphonGrrlPosted: 2009-07-04 19:14
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I would, quite honestly, tell the person to step back for a while and get him/herself together before going further.
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HarukosKittenPosted: 2009-07-10 01:19
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onesassylassy:
To give you an idea of where I'm coming from, when limper and I first met in person, I couldn't handle ANYTHING too close to my face or neck - especially my throat. Now, 2 yrs and a pair of wedding rings later (though this development came before the rings), he can often BITE my throat (though he still can't make it a rapid attack), and I sometimes even crave it, when we play. Not always on either count - but even on the (now rare) occasions when I can't go there, he has learned to read me well enough to prevent it from turning to panic for me. To us, that is HUGE progress, compared to barely being able to even kiss the side of my neck, slowly and in a 'vanilla' manner

Same here only it was with oral sex preformed on a man. At first it was a hard limit I didnt want to do EVER. I've been with Master a year and half now and slowly and surely and with a LOT OF TRUST I'm able to give him a pretty decent blowjob (though he say's they're beyond) but the main thing is I trust him and he knows when and where to stop if I start to feel uncomfortable. And now he's teaching me how to deep throat him _wink _tongue
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IN NOMINE DEI NOSTRE SATANAS EXCELSI!

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puppygirltrainerPosted: 2009-07-10 07:09
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Best we leave it in therapy then. You know with the "professionals".
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